Fair Hearing Talks To Sami Yaffa of the New York Dolls

Photo © Max Lakner

It’s an early summer evening in Surrey and a bustling lunchtime in New York. We caught up with bass player Sami Yaffa to talk about the band, the new album and the group’s imminent visit to England to play the legendary 100 Club, still the stamping ground for Wilko Johnson, the Pretty Things, Yardbirds et al in London’s Oxford Street.

Sami has since his early years with the energetic Hanoi Rocks played in many cult lineups, for example Demolition 23, Jerusalem Slim with Billy Idol guitar man Steve Stevens, Jet Boy, Johnny Thunders (an original Doll), Alison Gordy, Mad Juana, Smack, Joan Jett, Vasquez and others.

The Dolls new album is reviewed elsewhere on our site, but suffice to say it plays like a vintage Stones album maybe somewhere between Beggars Banquet and Some Girls, with outright rocking cuts and mellower, subtly embellished acoustic/electric outings and very contemporary elements well to the fore here and there. Slick it ain’t but this crew are far beyond monochrome Ramones-style album making and furthermore they are back working with Todd Rundgren. Apart from a re-styling of NYD fave ‘Trash’, the band present eleven new compositions that make ‘ Cause I Sez So’ a treat for any rocker or music fan. Yaffa is a friendly cove with a warm, deep laugh and laidback presence and he’s bang on time for our chat…

FH : Are you looking forward to coming back over to London ?

SY : I used to live in London ! Back in the Hanoi Rocks era

FH : Yeah you used to play in Scandinavia, Europe, all over

SY : Correct and we were based in London for about three years in that time period

FH : I really liked the Mike Monroe solo album..

SY : Well Mike and I, we did put a record together later for Demolition 23, along with Little Steven ( Springsteen guitar man, radio DJ, actor !- PS) in 1994…it had a limited release, Pete, came out in Japan and a few other countries

FH : Now your 100 Club show sold out in about three minutes, how do you feel about that ??

SY : Last time I was there, it really ****ed up my head ! It was maybe around ‘84..(Sami laughs at the memory )

FH : Now you’re playing bass with the New York Dolls – the phrase ‘Lucky B******d’ springs to mind…how did you get this gig ?

SY : Well I did a lot of shows touring with Johnny Thunders, as you know..and also I’ve known Sylvain for a long long time and when Syl called it was kinda like..’OK..This could be fun..’ I guess they auditioned a couple of bass players and you know they told me to learn a few songs from their first album..I said what ones do you want to suggest and they said which ones do you know and I said, well name any song and I do know it..

FH : ‘Jet Boy’ and ‘Pills’ and all that stuff ?

SY : Yeah ! So we went as a band through the whole first album and I was happy after that..and now making this latest record with David and Syl, it kinda completes the picture..it’s the icing on the cake !

FH : I bet..David sounds..well on this record I can’t decide whether he is in a very mellow mood or fired up..or somewhere in between !

SY : (Thoughtfully) Well…he maybe is !…it wasn’t a case of just making a bangbangbang record,it was more about concentrating on songwriting..getting all the various influences in there..we had together about fifteen, sixteen songs and those were the ones that kept popping up as right for the record..and half the record is pretty mellow..

FH : To me the album seems to play like ‘Some Girls’ or ‘Let It Bleed’..it has that kind of city, summery, various moods thing in there..am I wrong on that ?

SY : Yeeeaaah !! I hadn’t thought of it that way, but I totally get that..maybe it’s being out in Hawaii making that record that did that ..?

FH : You can smell the smoke..

SY : (Emphatically) I never said that ! (Laughs)

FH : There’s two words..well maybe four words..that I have to throw into this – ‘Arthur Kane’ and ‘Big Shoes’…( The late Mr Kane passed away not long after the Dolls triumphant London show at the Royal Festival Hall in 2004- PS)

SY : (Sighs) Yeah – VERY big shoes to fill..some people didn’t think he was the greatest bass player, but I disagree, the choices that he made when playing the songs, the skill with which he could play, he was a ****ing genius, to me

FH : Absolutely ! Bill Wyman once said to me ‘Pete – if you’re noticing the bass player, he’s not very good ‘

SY : (Roars with laughter) That’s beautiful !! it’s that whole approach, y’know, the classic bass players..they had that..

FH : Willie Dixon..they took care of business and they weren’t fighting for attention

SY : Exactly..not looking on the bass as a soloing instrument

Sami favours SVT basses and Ampeg amps for most touring work, gearheads

FH : Is there a bass player that you particularly admire ?

SY : Bill Wyman and Keef Richards bass playing…Bob Marley’s guys, the Barretts..playing for the groove..now, listening wise I do like some of the jazz players’ work..Mingus, especially, when he sings as well ‘I hope that atom bomb doesn’t drop on me’ – ha!

When I was a bit older, I heard Captain Sensible ( Ray of The Damned – PS)..amazing player ! And Lemmy and all that stuff

FH : Ray’s always had this ’song’ thing, he plays for the song

SY : Right, so they’ve been my main influences

FH : I have a soft spot for Glenn Hughes

SY : (Enthuses) And he can sing, like Stevie Wonder !

FH : This touring lineup – Sylvain seem to be absolutely fired up, sparking off the other guitar

SY : Yeah, now he and Steve, they..we been together now four or five years..it’s melded into a unit, they really do complement each other as guitar players

FH : He sounds blissfully happy

SY : Happy and sloppy ! (chuckes)

FH : Do you have a favourite track on the new album ?

SY : Hmmm…as far as rock’n'roll songs, mabe ‘Exorcism of Despair’..

FH : Aha ! The album closer..it has a voodoo feel to it, hasn’t it ?

SY : Yes, it’s kind of anarchic in a way, a big mess…whether it’s gonna fall apart or keep going. I really like that

FH : It’s Afghan Whigs territory

SY : Exactly, its not like an Old School thing..oh and I like ‘My World’ a lot..and then ‘Ridiculous’ which has that old blues kinda thing goin’ on

FH : David’s having such fun on that and his voice sounds a lot deeper

SY : It’s a little like what happened to Bob Dylan, I think  ( Yaffa throws in lightning impressions of Zimmerman old and new, it’s hilarious – PS )

FH : Now Todd Rundgren to his credit, he doesn’t try to turn the Dolls into the Tubes on this album..he seems to let the organic sound come through, how does that work in the studio ?

SY : We did this..er.. there’s almost no overdubs on the record, there’s no keyboards on the record..I played the percussion and the shakers on the tracks

FH : Ah, Sami – it’s YOU responsible for the Mink DeVille sound here and there then !

SY : You got me! We basically did four takes on each number and then we chose the one that felt the best .. it was a simple and quick kinda process.. we had half the songs together and David had about half the lyrics before we started and so we spent the first week over there just putting those songs together..what we didn’t do was go over and over this collection with ProTools ‘fixing’ this and that..

FH : Isn’t there a certain irony having such an urban, bustling band recording in Hawaii ?

SY : (Laughs) Yeah ! The local populus was like..in shock.. who ARE these people ? I have NEVER done a record like this before, usually you’re in back rooms, darkness, no windows anywhere..when we got there, we kept asking Todd where the studio was…it was in fact his living room !..he said ‘You’re standing in it..’  and sometimes we recorded outdoors as well.. we were also at times in different rooms all set up..but we could see each other..and then someone would go ‘Look ! Whales, man!!’ and you’d look across and there’s be whales goin’ by !

FH : To me the record is a nice blend of warmth and edge..to the band’s credit it does not repeat the earlier albums.. it’s going somewhere a bit more..well, street/country

SY : Right, there’s this song I wrote called ‘Temptation To Exist’ which is weird kinda desert thing..but initially it was somewhere near ‘Subway Train’, but then we started playing it and Steve came up with the whistling melody and then the guitar lines..and it moved then into this really beautiful New Mexico, desert feel song.. a very interesting way of developing this song.same thing with the song ‘Muddy Bones’, a country & western tune..very mellow Gram Parsons type piece and then David says ‘**** it ! Let’s do it like the Who would do it !’  -and that’s the result..

FH : That a Smithereens trick, too, they’ll take a George Harrison song and do it like the Who and the colours leap out of it

SY : So we tossed and turned those songs a lot, different approaches and most of it fell into the right place…

Pete Sargeant   www.fairhearing.co.uk

The New York Dolls appear on Later with Jools Holland at 10pm Tuesday May 12th on BBC 2 and on the Friday night fuller edition May 15th. More info on the Rhino/Atco album and everything else on www.nydolls.org